This should be viewed by any one who places muslims in the category of "peaceful" people!!

Comment

Comment by Ted on August 31, 2010 at 12:36am

I personally have moved beyond this video and more into trying to find out, even though this particular video is not a ceremonial stoning , how long will it be, if ever, that we would see a true video of one. I am especially anxious that I not see one filmed from my shores. It would still disturb me to no end, to see it from anyone's shore. Humans should have moved beyond this in the past few hundred years.

Comment by djprophet on August 31, 2010 at 12:28am

Words from Stan the Peaceful Orator

Almost all religions undergo reformations during the course of their existance. Unfortunately, some don't always agree with the reformations and stay with the original doctrines, and some even sometimes go backwards, or become Fundamentalists as they are called. And this is where the problems come from. Years ago, when reading and writing and education was the exception and not the rule, times were more violent.

Well said my friend.

Comment by djprophet on August 31, 2010 at 12:25am

Nicely Clarified Stanley!!!

You are truly a WARRIOR of Peace.

Comment by VideoMonkey on August 30, 2010 at 4:09pm

I wanted to make it clear one more time about this particular video...THE PEOPLE IN IT ARE NOT MUSLIM... they are of a regional and actually mostly Christian (there I go using words loosely again) sect in Northern Iraq.
At least six of the men seen actually doing violence to this poor girl were arrested, put on trail, and are now dead as she it (the were just hanged though). At least 24 other men who were no doubt present (this is a very small religion of a couple thousand) were allegedly rounded up and assassinated by Al Queda... they did not go unpunished.

I like what Asteraea Shaw said:

" I really do not think that educated people in any country would be capable of such unspeakable cruelty, but the less educated of any country I have known are capable of this - and worse."

I have to agree with this. I could go into why, but I'm really trying to stop being so long winded here, If you are curious, feel free to message me.

I'm no Islamic expert either, but having looked over Ted's list, I'm sure I've heared some of these things before. But there are a few different sect's and degrees of Islamics (much like there are varried kinds of Christian groups) and I'm pretty sure they do not all have the same rules. I think the reason Religions end up this way is because, and this goes to what I mentioned Asteraea Shaw said above and what Ted also said earlier about the Christian Crusades and Inquisitions, that people, as they become more educated, see that the things done are wrong, even evil, and will refuse to be a part of it unless it is changed. Almost all religions undergo reformations during the course of their existance. Unfortunately, some don't always agree with the reformations and stay with the original doctrines, and some even sometimes go backwards, or become Fundamentalists as they are called. And this is where the problems come from. Years ago, when reading and writing and education was the exception and not the rule, times were more violent. Ideas were more violent. Now that we have learned that there are peaceful solutions to problems, society has changed and I like to think grown or developed to reflect this. Society is as much in flux and growing as we are in our individual lives. We are not the same people we were five, ten, twenty years ago...nor is society the same as 20, 100 or even a thousand years ago...

..opps I'm going on too long again. I think I will leave it to you as a homework assignment to think about what I said in the last paragraph and see if you can decide where I was going with this. I'll just say this, these Yazidi we see in the video consist of about 3000 Kurdish people living in several close knit villages in Northern Iraq. They have minimal contact with outside people, living a lot like maybe our North American Mennonites in comparison. They definately need a bigger world-view.

I tried to stay short because I have one last thing. A CNN video I found that explains some of the circumstances behind the video Ted Posted. And check this out! I'm not just seeing things, someone else saw it too and this supports (but does NOT confirm) what I read elsewhere about the retaliation attack maybe being staged for whatever reason. As stated in the tube comments for this video:
"*Try to pay attention and you will notice in this video from frame 02:00 to 02:10, the part where the 20 Yazidi men lay dead, who were supposedly killed in a reprisal for the stoning - notice the left foot of the fourth man from the right laying on the ground gently moves. Is this for real or do dead men move their feet?"

Maybe he was just a twitcher....
Here is the video:

Comment by Ted on August 29, 2010 at 11:17am

........continuation..............

33- A Muslim man is forgiven if he kills his wife caught in the act of adultery. However, the opposite is not true for women since he “could be married to the woman he was caught with.”
The above are clear cut laws in Islam decided by great Imams after years of examination and interpretation of the Quran, Hadith and Mohammed’s life. Now let the learned Imam Rauf tell us what part of the above is compliant with the US constitution?

Comment by Ted on August 29, 2010 at 11:16am

ok, here is some information I have concerning Islam. This is what I do not want on my shores. If it is inaccurate, please enlighten me

1- Jihad defined as “to war against non-Muslims to establish the religion” is the duty of every Muslim and Muslim head of state (Caliph). Muslim Caliphs who refuse jihad are in violation of Sharia and unfit to rule.
2- A Caliph can hold office through seizure of power meaning through force.
3- A Caliph is exempt from being charged with serious crimes such as murder, adultery, robbery, theft, drinking and in some cases of rape.
4- A percentage of Zakat (alms) must go towards jihad.
5- It is obligatory to obey the commands of the Caliph, even if he is unjust.
6- A caliph must be a Muslim, a non-slave and a male.
7- The Muslim public must remove the Caliph in one case, if he rejects Islam.
8- A Muslim who leaves Islam must be killed immediately.
9- A Muslim will be forgiven for murder of : 1) an apostasy 2) an adulterer 3) a highway robber. Making vigilante street justice and honor killing acceptable.
10- A Muslim will not get the death penalty if he kills a non-Muslim.
11- Sharia never abolished slavery and sexual slavery and highly regulates it. A master will not be punished for killing his slave.
12- Sharia dictates death by stoning, beheading, amputation of limbs, flogging and other forms of cruel and unusual punishments even for crimes of sin such as adultery.
13- Non-Muslims are not equal to Muslims and must comply to Sharia if they are to remain safe. They are forbidden to marry Muslim women, publicly display wine or pork, recite their scriptures or openly celebrate their religious holidays or funerals. They are forbidden from building new churches or building them higher than mosques. They may not enter a mosque without permission. A non-Muslim is no longer protected if he commits adultery with a Muslim woman or if he leads a Muslim away from Islam.
14- It is a crime for a non-Muslim to sell weapons to someone who will use them against Muslims. Non-Muslims cannot curse a Muslim, say anything derogatory about Allah, the Prophet, or Islam, or expose the weak points of Muslims. However, the opposite is not true for Muslims.
15- A non-Muslim cannot inherit from a Muslim.
16- Banks must be Sharia compliant and interest is not allowed.
17- No testimony in court is acceptable from people of low-level jobs, such as street sweepers or a bathhouse attendant. Women in such low level jobs such as professional funeral mourners cannot keep custody of their children in case of divorce.
18- A non-Muslim cannot rule even over a non-Muslims minority.
19- Homosexuality is punishable by death.
20- There is no age limit for marriage of girls under Sharia. The marriage contract can take place anytime after birth and consummated at age 8 or 9.
21- Rebelliousness on the part of the wife nullifies the husband’s obligation to support her, gives him permission to beat her and keep her from leaving the home.
22- Divorce is only in the hands of the husband and is as easy as saying: “I divorce you” and becomes effective even if the husband did not intend it.
23- There is no community property between husband and wife and the husband’s property does not automatically go to the wife after his death.
24- A woman inherits half what a man inherits.
25- A man has the right to have up to 4 wives and she has no right to divorce him even if he is polygamous.
26- The dowry is given in exchange for the woman’s sexual organs.
27- A man is allowed to have sex with slave women and women captured in battle, and if the enslaved woman is married her marriage is annulled.
28- The testimony of a woman in court is half the value of a man.
29- A woman looses custody if she remarries.
30- To prove rape, a woman must have 4 male witnesses.
31- A rapist may only be required to pay the bride-money (dowry) without marrying the rape victim.
32- A Muslim woman must cover every inch of her body which is considered

Comment by Ted on August 29, 2010 at 10:30am

As I ponder the whole situation I think the arguments boil down to, is execution by another human justified and what are the justifiable reasons. After that has been determined then what form of of execution is acceptable, who and how it should be carried out. I personally think if executing someone is justifiable, it should be done in the most humane and merciful way possible and it must achieve a progress that is needed to further an entities existence and enrichment. If execution for a particular reason is not justified, how does one handle the situation or human that has performed a horrendous act against a fellow human?

I don't know about anyone else but I seem to have lost the life manual that I came out of the womb with. If I try to borrow one from someone else, they seem to have lost theirs too. So I guess mankind has started all over evolving without that manual and there are so many different people with so many different ideas of how it should be done. There are so many supposed manuals too such as the Koran, Torah, Bible, Word of mouth passed down, tablets found, divine inspirations, figures in a tea leaf and so on. If we take pieces out of each form, which piece do we take? The piece that says there is a creator? Or the piece that says man shall only eat the brain of another? Or man should only eat fish on friday.

So, I think if a form of religion wants to coexist with another, the laws of the land and government should be obeyed. I have no problem with the many religions (or lack thereof) in my country and feel they have every right to practice it and will fight to protect that right. However that practice should in no way infringe upon or, belittle another religion. It should not infringe on the free movement and practices of ALL the people of that society. And it should only adhere to the forms of punishment, executions or whatever else the consciousness of the people as a whole, have found acceptable. If someone in another country wants to slaughter someone for walking with a man that they are not related to, fine, just don't bring those actions here on my shores. I for one, do not condone it at all.

Comment by Asteraea Shaw on August 29, 2010 at 10:22am

ps. I made myself watch that video. What kind of people do this? It is not because they are Muslims. They are just very primitive.

I do understand the reaction of decent people to this. I have the same reaction - but I think it is a matter of class. I really do not think that educated people in any country would be capable of such unspeakable cruelty, but the less educated of any country I have known are capable of this - and worse.

It is difficult for me to understand that the Tibetans in spite of their Buddhism, so deeply respected and loved by the people of Tibet, "The Buddha Dharma" , the precious teachings, yet they used to cut off the noses of young women - cut off hands for theft, just as the Muslims do sometimes!
They seemed to think that blinding people quite acceptable!!! ??? In fact, there was a high lama called Reting Rinpoche who was a close friend of the Dalai Lama, who had a very fine and noble man blinded because he thought Tibet should be opened up. It might have been much better for Tibet if it had opened up to the wider World.

Comment by Ted on August 29, 2010 at 9:47am

Now I think we are getting somewhere! As I posted in another discussion with Stan, I had received that video in an email and my very soul cried out for that woman. I definitely opened this thread in a state of emotion. That is why I asked if we want that sort of thing on our shores. I know very little about Islam and I stick with what I know so far, it is not a religion, it is a social way of life. I in no way intend nor believe it to be an attack on all Muslims. Most of us here in the U.S. know little about Islamic law and with the activity associated with the Mosque so close to ground zero as we call it, has caused great concern. The reaction to that, I suppose, is the same as if we were trying to introduce Christianity or Democracy to an area that has never dealt with it and it goes against all they have been taught.

As I've voiced before, most all peoples have a religion or way of life that points to a single entity or place of utopia. Each one has their own belief structure of how the individual should behave as a member of their specific community and each one has their own belief structure of what this utopia is and how to earn the right to get there or, who has the right to be there. Since these beliefs and structures are governed by members of mankind, they are going to be full of mistakes, misinterpretations and elite-isms. Sooner or later, someone within the structure is going to want to use that structure to control others.
Any large entity whether it be governments, businesses/corporations or religions are up for ridicule because of the human involvement. What I have looked for in all of them that concern me....related to governments, the people are looking for safety, peaceful existence, food, clothing, shelter. Most feel a strong military ensures those things. As their population grows and their raw materials run low, they look other places to replace them. Other people with other beliefs are in those places and thus justifications for war begin to fester and religions gets brought into the picture and then various alliances form. Sometimes, the alliances are not just for the comfortable existence of the people trying to spread, it is also to spread their religion because that is what is used to control the masses. No one believes they can win anything by going against their god so, control is a bit easier.
So, so far, my indoctrination of Islam, the only thing I've had for that sort of information, has caused me to believe it is not something I want on my shores. Anyone is welcome here but any other form of government is not, we already have an EVOLVING government that people on this dirt should recognize. Their religion should be what they will, the form of government should not.

Comment by Asteraea Shaw on August 29, 2010 at 6:41am

Some countries practise female circumcision but that has nothing to do with Islam. Nothing.
Some countries shoot female adulterers in the back of the head - that is their culture, but has nothing whatsoever to do with Islam.
Some countries stone people to death for various reasons - the Greeks on some of the islands did so until quite recently. This has nothing to do with Islam.
In some countries women are not expected or allowed to drive. This has nothing to do with Islam.

You should try not to be swept away with the tide of brain washing encouraging the foolish and those without minds of their own, and you should definitely try not to be one of those who will be responsible for the murder of many people, human beings that is, in the country of Iran. That is what this stupid propaganda about Islam is designed for - an attack, for the Jews, against another Islamic country, Iran.

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